the size of the house in the plan is the max already, as in i cant have a larger living or extend the garage.. i have to sacrifice the bed 4 if needed.. if i were to move the kitchen partition.. (im still trying to visualize that)..

Hopefully, one of the design pros will comment on this, because I'm strictly amateur, but what would happen if you put the butler's pantry where the 4th bedroom is, the kitchen next to it, and the opening out to the deck where the kitchen now is?. You could then use the area for the butler's pantry as your entrance from garage. And since you wouldn't need the whole bedroom area for the butler's pantry, you'd have your larger kitchen/dining space. Of course, it all depends on whether that 4th bedroom is needed. And whether my idea makes any actual sense :)

my preference is to have more reasonable space, 4th bedroom is optional and its mainly for resale value only...

do you think the back garage door should be 'open' instead ??

I like cherlind's idea of repurposing the fourth bedroom. You should definitely keep the garage door access to kitchen area. What do you mean by keeping the back garage door "open"? Perhaps a single roller door to the rear of the garage door, enabling car access to back yard?

I'd move the fridge into the kitchen (as I would find it annoying accessing the fridge via the pantry), then access the house via the pantry. I'd also consider removing the sink in the pantry.

I don't really understand the appeal of a butler's pantry unless you have hired help when entertaining. If you wanted to keep the fridge in the pantry, then you could put it where the sink currently is.

A single sink in the ensuite is a personal decision, but there does seem to be a serious lack of counter space with two sinks. I think it would be fine.

Finally, depending upon your mother's needs, both now and potentially in the future, you may want to consider whether the main bathroom will suit her.

Good luck!

so i guess now the question is whether to remove bed 4 or not..

I think, to be honest, that you need to talk to a pro about this. You need to see whether any of the ideas being tossed up will work or make any sense, and you also need to understand what the market will likely be in your area over the medium to longer term. If you're planning to live in that house for the foreseeable future, then design it to fit your needs; if you're looking at resale, think about who likely buyers would be. Families will want four bedrooms, older folks will be happy with three. Lots of things to think about.

PS. Haephestus is probably right about that sink in the butler's pantry. We have a small pantry (which is very useful - got a wine fridge, microwave and toaster in there, plus lots of extra storage for larger items not used every day - but we almost never use the sink).

@ jmm1837, thanks for your valuable input, the difficult part is im not sure whether i will be in this house for long term or not.. which is why making the decision so hard and im doing it all by myself !! agreed with the sink removal in the pantry..

@sttop, thats my initial design, but later they came back and said, the 60% coverage on the land, so i need to move the laundry somewhere.. im not sure how i can combine the pantry and the laundry in the existing space of the pantry now.. if you can provide an idea, would love to 'hear'..

Laundry and pantry in the same room? Plus a mudroom? Doesn't sound like a tasteful combination. Seriously, take the fridge out of the pantry. You're like into the fridge every 20 seconds while you're cooking, not to mention when unpacking shopping, and running into the pantry, even just inside the pantry will be a total pain. You don't *really" need the void beside the garage door, as coming from the garage with shopping, it can just go on the bench and be redistributed from there. The rest of the time, you can much better have that void as bench space instead. Then you can put your fridge either in that spot or against the back wall.

1/ you'd need an internal door to garage as it is more convenient and especially in Winter when it's cold and wet.

2/I'd redraw the whole plan..because there's better ways to fit everything in ..

what about turning it around like this ? that way you've got more space you can turn your pantry into a laundry ..your kitchen where bedroom 4 used to be and then you've got a massive living area? I haven't drawn it to scale ..just a thought?

modified version (with all the comments i got from here)

- garage internal door will be from laundry (picture not showing the where the real doors are, as i just cut and paste to show the position of the rooms)

- remove bed4 and added study nook, so the living wont be next to the WC..

what do you guys think ??

the last plan gives you a bigger living space ..though the bedroom 2 is too far from the WC..if you want to separate the bedrooms you'd need to tag on a WC for middle of the night emergencies ..

most house plans pops the the bathroom in between the two remaining bedrooms as the master has the ensuite already and can be a stand alone

Hi Carole Loe

You have an interesting house proposal, you are very lucky that you managed to get a corner block, there are advantages in a corner blocks, and like all things some disadvantages.

It would be helpful to get an idea where north is in relation to your plan, its difficult to give constructive comments without knowing the position of the sun in relation to living areas and windows.

Looking at your first plan the position of your bedrooms are relatively well placed, Bedroom 1 robes are a bit of a problem as they may be exposed from excessive moisture from the ES Shower even if you have a strong exhaust. This generally results in moldy clothes and shoes that smell. Its always good to have the Walk In Robes closed off from the ES.

Looking at your second plan I would consider bedroom 2 to be a very difficult bedroom to use, especially if you are aging or young, not a good selling item in the long run.

You have to cross a living area to get to the toilet and you are constantly bombarded by living room noise.

The proposed separate toilet, with internal opening door is very difficult to use (illegal in Victoria unless you provide 'panic hinges') and not very friendly if you are aging. Some redesign of this area could be beneficial in the long run.

Your front entry is shown at 1330 and this is at the stud positions with an 820 door (I always make my front entries min. 870)- (that is incredibly tight for a porch area entry something like 1880 to 2400 with a 870 front door and a bit of a sidelight might be a bit better), you may wish to look at this further, it seems to be terribly tight - measure some of your friends entries and your may wish to revisit this part of your design.

Also I think its a good idea to provide access to the the garage from the house - but it must go through an airlock (e.g. through a well ventilated laundry or an open verandah) then to your living areas. This would avoid mixing exhaust fumes with your lounge furniture and your kitchen areas. These toxins build up overtime and are certainly not very good for your health, especially if you are you or old or small like a child or a dog or a cat.

Your kitchen and butlers pantry design is certainly ample for two or three people, but it would consider fronting the 'front kitchen bench' towards where you have your TV. Also the kitchen counter should not have a stove on it. The stove should be places about 800 from the sink so that in an emergency you can go from your stove to the sink and not have to cross a from the front bench to the back bench via a travel space. This would make your kitchen bench a good entertainment area or even a good eating area if carefully designed.

It would be helpful to know the position of the neighbor houses, houses windows in relation to the site, especially for overlooking and possible overshadowing to open areas.

Also it might be helpful for you to define the brief a little more, so that you can be a little more positive of your requirements.

There is no mention of fences, gates, driveway extent, extent of porches over entries front and back entry, external paths to drying areas, clothes drying areas, BBQ position or garden areas, vegetable garden area, external storage for gardening tools, letter box etc. these are all items that should come in the design phase and discussed and have proper space allocations.

A reassessment of your design position may be fruitful and financially beneficial in the long run especially if you are willing to do some of the legwork to reduce some of your costs.

I would be happy to consider your design proposal further.

Wish you the best in your design pursuit.

Regards
Michael Manias - (03)9347-7347 - Designing online using Skype, Pdf and Paypal - mm407p@gmail.com

Hi Carole

As Michael said knowing the orientation of the home to the sun and your location is critical to providing any advice at all.

You mention that you will live alone most of the time; why pay for the construction, furnishing and running of a four bedroom home? Personally I would invest in a higher quality yet smaller home (quality can be whatever floats your boat, mine would a 'house with no bills' and 'house with no need for heating/cooling')

I agree with the others that you should seek professional input before committing to a design.

Good luck on your journey

Hi,

If you want to change the door from the garage into the house I would move it from the lounge into the pantry, I have seen it before and think that it could work for you.

Hi, Apologies if anything I mention has been said already! How does the design and living areas in particular relate to your outdoor areas? You seem to have a large vacant space behind the Garage and only a sliding door going from the meals outdoors? I would definitely keep a door from the Garage directly into the house and if you're starting with a new design on a vacant site (ie. not working an addition onto an existing house), there should be no reason that you can't get that to work and maximise the site. Good luck :)

I would suggest reading about ageing in place. If a person uses a walker or a wheel chair this house would be very difficult to move in. My new house plan will have 920 doorways and wider halls and bath areas for ease of movement. Many of your doorways are presently 720 which is narrower than standard 820.