Advice needed for stair design issues in new build

6 years ago

We are doing a new build and the stairs have recently been installed but are not what I requested. I asked for a half turn staircase with a flat mid landing which is what was drawn on the plans. The stairs installed have a step in the mid-landing.

The builder is saying the only way to put a flat mid-landing is to come out into the hallway. He says he needs an additional 400mm, the allowance for the stair and 10mm for each step to account for the pitch change. I don't really get why they need the extra 10mm for each step. There is about 250mm-300mm of distance that they could use at the bottom which would not impact on the hallway significantly but the extra 100mm would not work as the hall is already more narrow, and further narrowed because I asked for a door in the hallway to seperate the front of the house from back living space. The front will be used for business purposes and needs to be separated.

I have a 4 and 3 year old and a baby due in 4 weeks. The stairs need to be as safe as possible for them. That is why I wanted the relief from the flat landing. On top off all that the handrail installed is awful from an ergonomic perspective. No way a child could grip it.

I don't know what to do, it you can think of any way that the stair could be changed to allow for a flat mid landing and not impact on the hallway. Or should I just live with the step in the mid landing even though it's not what I requested. And should I ask them to change the handrail.

Photos for reference. The second 2 photos are at the bottom to show the distance available to play with. I don't have the actual stair design spec's but the builder says it's at the limit for compliance with the building code.

Featured Answer

dreamer

6 years ago

Hi Beck B, I had exactly the same situation when building our home. I requested a flat landing. When visiting our home during construction I noticed that all the form work for concrete pour for stairs was done with a step in the landing. The builders explanation was exactly the same as your builder. I went with this change, as it was too time consuming to redo all of the form work. I also revisited plans, and there had been a change, during design stages, which I had failed to notice. I am pleased with the end result. We would of had to have an extra stair coming into hallway. This would have been a tripping hazard, for people walking along hall. It is not want you wanted, but way up time frames,the extra step required into hallway, etc. I think it will be suitable. Much better than little wedge like stairs going around corners. HOwever, I would request the the odd wall gets redone to the same angle as stairs. Please see photos of my final product.

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Comments (18)

PRO
MB Design & Drafting
6 years ago
I can only guess the designer hasn't allowed quite enough space for stairs or the rise is say 170mm instead of the maximum at 190mm. Can't tell the rise from the pictures. Perhaps see if they can extend out to lower hallway instead.....

Having said that I don't think its a major issue, not what you requested but........ Certainly much better than having a couple steps there.... (3 step winder) not a fan of those as they have extra steps at that mid level area which to me are unsafe if you're not cautious.

I would be requesting a different handrail though.... preferably a full handrail all the way up. Good luck with it all.
Beck B thanked MB Design & Drafting
oklouise
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
to have the continuous landing means changing the whole staircase not just the bottom section...changing the pitch only for the bottom section means that the top section would be different but i wonder if the whole staircase was rebuilt, as originally designed, would the staircase need to project out into the hall?....it's disappointing that this mistake has happened and you were not told before the builder changed the design and i would check with your designer to identify the exact riser and tread size intended for the whole staircase, compare to the space available and consider having the whole staircase rebuilt and definitely remove that odd half wall which if replaced with an open railing may allow for the extra step across the landing to be less objectionable??
Beck B thanked oklouise
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PRO
Paul Di Stefano Design
6 years ago
at the very least the central wall should be cut down to rake with the stair angle - it looks less than ideal currently. In regards to the stair configuration, it's obviously better to have the stairs recessed in from the hall like they are (as opposed to sticking out). stairs can be tricky to configure and it comes down to considering the number of rises required within the floor level change and then ensuring the "going" (step depth) dimension is to standard/within code. I think the config is ok even though not ideal to your preferences. Unfortunately they/builder should have at least had the conversation with you, but possibly this detail was not understood to be that important? Who knows with those guys sometimes.. Possibly either the number of risers within the space/config available obviously was incorrectly drawn, or the stair area has been built smaller than drawn..either way what's done is done..... In order to advise any potential alternatives really we'd need fully accurate/precise dimensions of the stair space and the floor level change. My guess however is that the stair builder has probably resolved it the best he can within the space available, albeit different to what you expected
Beck B thanked Paul Di Stefano Design
dreamer
6 years ago
My stair info. All to building standards.
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Beck B thanked dreamer
oklouise
6 years ago
this information does show the extra stair (number 9) across the landing so the builder has constructed according to the plans
Beck B thanked oklouise
dreamer
6 years ago
Hi Oklouise, the plans are my final stair specs, not Bec b. When building, the original stair specs had a flat landing, but then along the way, with other changes, the stairs specs got changed, and I did not notice until form work was in situ. Just a little hiccup in the wonderful world of building. I am pleased with the end result.
Beck B thanked dreamer
oklouise
6 years ago
my mistake, i thought they were Bec's stairs and was so impressed with the actual tread depth, riser height and width of the stairs i didn't pay enough attention but if Bec's stair dimensions are similar they should be very comfortable to use
Beck B thanked oklouise
Dawn Park
6 years ago
I would have pool panels as stair rails too create light &space wood on flooring on stairs
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dreamer
6 years ago
Dawn park, I assume you mean a glass balustrade. In my opinion this would need constant cleaning, and there would be nothing to hang onto for little hands. Beck b has a 4, 3 year old and a new born on the way. Either a wooden balustrade with turned post, or powder coated aluminium. This balustrade could follow the stairs if the small wall in middle of stairs is angled.
Beck B thanked dreamer
Beck B
Original Author
6 years ago
Hi everyone, thank you for your feedback. So we took some measurements and it appears that they really have only just left enough space to fit in the original design with no margin for error. Without being millimetre perfect, which I know is impossible to achieve, if I ask them to rip out the current stairs, I suspect I'll be left with a worse situation and a stair in the hallway. Really very upset with this, I expected a custom designed house to be as designed, otherwise we probably should have just gone with a project home which would have cost a lot less! I was very clear with them about the stairs, absolutely no winders, a flat platform and no where in any plans was there a step in the landing! This whole house was designed around the stairs, which is why I'm so annoyed that it's not correct!

With respect to the weird wall in the middle, that will be plastered up and capped to rake up with the stairs. The photo's don't show the large window in the stairwell, and once painted white, it should still be very light and bright. I considered glass, very briefly, I'm not keen on cleaning that and thought I would end up with toy's being posted through a balustrade. The tread will remain oak and the riser will be painted white. Going for a modern Australian coastal, hamptons look, classic but not too traditional.

I am going to ask them to address the stair frame and step it down in parallel with the step, as opposed to the angle that is currently there on the mid landing, it just looks really bad when looking up the stairs and the handrail as the kids will need something to hold on to now there is a step in the mid landing. I'll also be asking that the stair frame sit's flush with the nib wall as it rounds the corner in the junction of the two flights. It sticks out a bit too far for my liking at the moment.

I really hope they don't get too many other things wrong!
louiab
6 years ago
I, too wanted a flat landing, especially with the garage door on the landing and this was the end result. With a 6 yo, 3yo and baby I was not impressed at the time. But to be honest none of the kids have ever fallen and I doubt ever used the hand rail. The baby learned to go down backwards on his tummy which terrified me at the time! I did have a stair gate for the first 6 mths or so. Good luck
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Beck B thanked louiab
Beck B
Original Author
6 years ago
Thankyou for your comment Blenkelec, it's reassuring that your experience is favourable and winders would be my worse nightmare as well! I will be installing stair gates, unfortunately they learn how they work way to quickly!! I hope this next kid is not a climber like the first two!
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dreamer
6 years ago
I am interested about the nib wall concept. If you had balustrade coming down at the same angle of stairs, this would naturally give something for little hands to hold. As I have posted before, the step in landing will be fine. What are you installing at the top landing, another wall or balustrade?
dreamer
6 years ago
I meant to say the central wall in stairs, not nib wall. I'm interested in the design concept. Just can't seem to understand what your end result will be. Thanks.
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Sampson Wong
3 years ago
Hi Beck B, I am having the same problem as you, the builder did not notify me and put extra step at the mid landing, but only thing difference is my house have morn than enough space at the bottom for the extra step. I was wondering if the builder have give you any credit for what they have done?
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Kate
3 years ago
Negotiate with the builder to share the diff in rebuild cost if you are happy to live with it. Be nice particularly if he is still finishing but be firm
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Julie Herbert
21 days ago
Houzz this is getting worse.