describe your climate, the direction of north and do you have any good or bad views

We dont have views tho intend putting in a pool adjacent to the patio and the kitchen/patio is north facing for winter sun in coastal central Qld which means the summer western sun is directly on Bed 1...but can't do much about that except for extensively plant shade trees and palms.

Is this photo of the plan sufficient for posters to work off? I will attempt to convert the PDF File if not. Cheers.

some of the dimensions are hard to read but my initial thoughts are that by rearranging the bathrooms there would be less western sun into the bedrooms and a gorgeous garden outlook for the bathrooms although the alfresco feels cramped for a tropical area where i would expect more indoor outdoor connection

please post a closer view the kitchen alfresco and living so the dimensions are easier to see and what is the width and depth of your block?

Have a look at how you'll furnish media/playroom.

Looks clunky to me with access points around the perimeter. We can end up with spaces like this now and then on alterations and additions and budget limitations but on a new build this could be designed out or designed better.

Keep in mind this space needs to be adaptable as the family changes. Little kids can spread their toys so not bad but teens/adults want seating, etc.

Main bedroom door isn't overly private, having the bed and bedsides not centred along a wall can also feel 'uncomfortable'. I can see why its drawn this way but I think it could be designed out.

I wouldn't bother with plumbing in the pantry. Inconvenient in reality (costs more to fit out well) as you need to cart plates, pots and pans, etc to dishwasher in pantry then back out to kitchen to store, cook and plate up... could have 2 dishwashers and one that gets rarely if ever used perhaps...

Thank you everyone for your input. I was hoping for feed back and was pleased to receive it from all of you :) I was not 100% happy with the plan and hence sought advice.

To try and address the issues that have arisen...a large shed will be built pn thid 1700m2 block at the rear on the master bed side. My husband wants 2 driveways hence the decision to have the garage at the front on the eastern aspect and he wants the main bathroom an toilet awsy from the living areas. I asked the draftsman to locate the pantry/laundry coming thru garage for grocery, mud room reasons (and the drying area oitside has to be on that side as well. I only gave him 245m2 to make it all happen hence the reduced outdoor patio which is 4650 x 3500. I am also concerned with the MPR as regards furniture arrangement. I asked for walk ins with Bed 3 and 4 so I have constrained him there also. And I also have concerns about Bed 1 and thought it may have to be extended under eaves to increase that wall length. I presently have a large BP and wished I had put the dishwasher in there rather than under main sink. I have noticed that kitchens seen to be changing from just work areas to more an entertaining area and I was planning on the BP being the main work area in this house..if that makes sense.

However I am very open to suggestions. Cheers.

Width 24m and length 78m..but a large 10x10 shed going up with access down bathroom side. We have decided the available dimension for the 24m is 6m for shed driveway, garden etc, 15m for house width and 3 metres for south/eastern boundary. Better pic of kitchen/outdoor area provided. I am not locked into this design and its only a preliminary design at this stage...although I was going to seek quotes from 3 builders.

Butlers Pantry's are a bit of a 'fad' at the moment. Hoping they got the way of formal dining rooms in all but the largest of homes.

I don't know about others but is doing prepwork in a space with little if any natural light, really that much fun? All aspects of cooking should be enjoyable including the prep. I guess its the 'non cooks' that are using kitchens as entertainment areas rather than a professional chef's. Pro Chef's can work miracles with a basic tiny kitchen....

I didn't mention it previously but I would relocate WIR to be near ENS or vice versa. This is usually how people use those areas, have shower then get dressed. Bit of a trek across room to get clothes, etc. By changing it you can centre the bed along the wall as well.

Wendy, I get all that, but unfortunately at this stage the plan developed here is not resolved as well as it could be to your needs within context - and you know that because you're not 100% happy with it. Forgive me if I say it feels more like a messed up volume build plan rather than a customised solution for your specific requirements. As I indicated in previous comment, drafting is (generally) a different level of service to design, although there are of course drafters who have good design skill. I understand/get that you're trying to direct the draftsman and you've put a bunch of constraints/requirements in the mix, but he's not hitting the mark is he......constraints, challenges etc are exactly what professional design deals with, negotiates, and resolves and it's a skill within itself and it's a different skill (and achieves completely different outcomes) to just fitting stuff in and putting stuff together. Considering you have a stack of swing room with this large block, the double driveway/shed is easily accommodated, there's really no excuse for a clunky compromised plan. With 78m of site depth there will be a far more elegant solution that could still be simple and cost effective, but from an spatial experience point of view, much higher value and more connected to and making the most of the site.

Wendy this won't be fixed (easily) with a few isolated suggestions, it's just not that straight forward - it arguably requires a complete overhaul....my suggestion with the best intentions for you investment is consider seeking some (professional) design assistance to at the very least resolve the layout. It will be worth it. Once the design is resolved you can then potentially pursue the documentation more cost effectively with say a draftsman. You have options, and you can get a better result that what's currently on the table....Cheers PD :)

Wendy mentioned getting quotes from 3 builders, does that mean their designs as well, I love builders but they aren't designers. I have to concur with MD on the pantry issue and will add my idea of what today's pantries should/could be.

From this

To the following cheers

I also concur with the butlers pantry syndrome. Open plan kitchens were invented so the cook can be part of the conversation and interaction. If butlers pantries continue to happen, then the cooks again are going to be stuck in a little room away from conversation and interaction.

Hi Wendy, this is an option for your main bedroom set up. Ignore measurements, but, thought the set up may work.

Dreamer and MD thank you very much for the Bed 1 WIR ideas.

Siriuskey we plan on getting 3 building quotes from the plan we have drawn up. Your suggestion re BP/Kitchen is to be mulled over ..Will take me a bit to re-evaluate the BP/Scullery I have had rusted on for a while now :)

PD thank you...I'm kinda unsure how to proceed. Our land estate hasn't been registered as yet so I have some time up my sleeve. To start all over seems daunting but there are issues...the MPR is my biggest concern.

some more ideas within similar size (excluding alfresco) and allowing space for the pool and more generous outdoor areas

oklouise...thank you so much...wonderful of you to show me another way :)


We had our minds set on the outdoor area being lined up with the back of the house so will have to think on that arrangement :) and also the drying area can only be alongside the garage so the Laundry needs to be on that side. I do sincerely thank you for taking the time to help out ...the help from Houzzers and the professionals on here is outstanding and so beneficial.

Whilst the separate mudroom and Study are very handy and we would love to have that, financially I need the Patio area to be included in the 245m2 (or thereabouts) footprint.

I don't have a pool, but I have read comments by others about the benefit of having easy access to the bathroom for kids/guests to save dripping all over the house. Oklouise has provided fairly direct bathroom access from the alfresco through the MPR.... Or would you be happy with everyone using your ensuite for this? Or do you have future plans for something external?

my suggested outdoor roof would not be part of the main roof ...for your climate a bigger outdoor area with a simple unconnected skillion roofed covered pergola would be more useable all year round...without the projecting bedrooms there are wider driveways and/or drying area down one or both sides of the house..ie 6m west driveway + 15m house + 3m east driveway with space for an easily enclosed good size pool close to bathroom and alfresco area with direct supervision from inside... but it's always good to consider a variety of options to help confirm the decisions you finally make

Verola roofs (opening pergolas) are great all year round for

alfresco areas and look good too

Our large shed will have an ensuite for pool use so we have that aspect covered and also planning a cabana type outdoor entertaining area in the pool area.


Yes I agree, the covered outdoor area roof line/vergola are very good ideas and I plan on using a few of the very good ideas suggested by you all :)

Hi Wendy, can you confirm that the shed is to the rear left of the property and the clothes line will be next to shed?

Hi Wendy,

Most of this has already been covered but just thought I'd add my thoughts too ... your entry way is lovely and open but then narrows slightly to accommodate your linen cupboard and butler's pantry that slightly juts out... I worry it will 'close the space down' instead of leaving it open and having that great feel maybe your'e chasing as you first walk into your home. If you still want a second linen cupboard, you could potential convert bed 2's robe into a linen cupboard that opens towards your kitchen and then build a robe for bed 2 in under the eave? Though not sure if that will be 'aesthetically pleasing' to the eye to have your lien cupboard there? I feel the same as most about the mpr.... but more that you need to access the bedrooms via the mpr... I get some house designs have activity rooms with bedrooms accessing from them but there's something a little off with the layout I can't put my finger on. If you've seen it in action already and happy with the layout, no worries... I just wanted to raise it with you. But if you haven't seen it in a display home or other house and how it functions, I would definitely check that out before committing to that idea. If you need to squeeze space, is shaving your walk in robes from bed 3 & 4 and putting in robes that are built in under the eave instead? You may also be able to save a little space and reconfigure your main bathroom by only having one vanity instead of two? The powder room has a vanity which is great so one in your main bathroom should be sufficient? With your master, I too would suggest adjoining your walk in robe and ensuite instead of having them split .... save having to walk from your shower, wrapped in your towel - or doing the nudie run lol - to your wardrobe to get dressed. I think those zones function better on many levels to be together, rather than separated. That's my unprofessional ideas anyway :) Good luck with your build Wendy.

Siriuskey...the 10x10 shed will be on the left side boundary 14m from the back of the house :)

Thanks, just re read where you said the clothes line will be on the same side as the garage, I was thinking it might have been between the back of the house and the shed,

I have done a quick floor plan changing the kitchen/Pantry/Laundry Mudroom, I think you mentioned that you likes to do the heavy yards in the pantry, this option gives you that while still being open to the kitchen, by removing the exterior door you can have sink and window. The laundry/mudroom still has access from the garage, and I was thinking that this laundry has easy access to the bedroom linen and that washing could be taken out via the Alfresco.

To cut back on costs I have removed the garage storage and the extended pantry laundry (Laundry on internal passage way as well., having such a big shed there should be space for plenty of storage. cheers

Hi Nic Star...thanks for your feed back.

General Notes.

The draftsman knows I am a storage freak hence the hall linen and extended BP. I will sketch the floor plan reducing that area and see how it looks. Although I did think that I could possibly re-jig the entrance from the kitchen into the BP by adding more central double barn doors? and that adapts the earlier idea presented to me (to link the kitchen BP more) but if I do that I will possibly need that extra space in the BP that encroaches into hall.

I thought I could put a little bench with coat rack hooks on the wall beside the hallway linen and front door and that may soften the look in the entry. I was looking for a casual coastal look anyway and that may suit.

I totally agree with the MPR clumsiness and accessibility. I have raised it with the draftsman but no solution has been resolved. The ideas given here made me think that perhaps the desk/drawers in MPR should be deleted until we see the space? then I thought maybe the whole wall could be removed? which would open it up substantially.

I will def relocate the Bed 1WIR next to ensuite as suggested.

I wanted a glass sliding door in Bed 2 for teenage separate entry so there wouldn't be any space for Robe under eaves there.

I will muck around with Bed 3 and 4 robes to see if that improves the facade options.

I could convert the Linen WIR to be Bed 2 Robe and present Bed 2 robe could convert to linen with doors facing kitchen..but I think I would prefer a wall there for artwork next to dining.

We only have one vanity in the main bathroom and the smaller one in the powder room.

I realise I am chopping and changing but want to try and get the best I can out of this floorplan and exhaust all options with it before possibly starting all over again.

Thanks again everyone.

Hi Nic Star...thanks for your feed back.

General Notes.

The draftsman knows I am a storage freak hence the hall linen and extended BP. I will sketch the floor plan reducing that area and see how it looks. Although I did think that I could possibly re-jig the entrance from the kitchen into the BP by adding more central double barn doors? and that adapts the earlier idea presented to me (to link the kitchen BP more) but if I do that I will possibly need that extra space in the BP that encroaches into hall.

I thought I could put a little bench with coat rack hooks on the wall beside the hallway linen and front door and that may soften the look in the entry. I was looking for a casual coastal look anyway and that may suit.

I totally agree with the MPR clumsiness and accessibility. I have raised it with the draftsman but no solution has been resolved. The ideas given here made me think that perhaps the desk/drawers in MPR should be deleted until we see the space? then I thought maybe the whole wall could be removed? which would open it up substantially.

I will def relocate the Bed 1WIR next to ensuite as suggested.

I wanted a glass sliding door in Bed 2 for teenage separate entry so there wouldn't be any space for Robe under eaves there.

I will muck around with Bed 3 and 4 robes to see if that improves the facade options.

I could convert the Linen WIR to be Bed 2 Robe and present Bed 2 robe could convert to linen with doors facing kitchen..but I think I would prefer a wall there for artwork next to dining.

We only have one vanity in the main bathroom and the smaller one in the powder room.

I realise I am chopping and changing but want to try and get the best I can out of this floorplan and exhaust all options with it before possibly starting all over again.

Thanks again everyone.

Siriuskey..sorry I replied before seeing that you had suggested an amended floor plan. It looks quite good and ordinarily a shed that size would be fine...but...you don't know my handyman husband lol...I managed to get a small she-shed section (for a hobby desk) but any more is non negotiable :).

Look forward to seeing the changes, I added furniture into the family room to show just how much space there is to play with. The attached photo is of a MPR at the entrance of a house, can't imagine that yours will remain to organized once the kids take over. Are you considering swapping the kids bedrooms with the master? cheers

Some of our most awesome Houzzers have helped me significantly with our house plan Wendy... they are very talented people, very giving & have excellent ideas & solutions so you’ve come to the right place :). I personally found the big wake up call for me was... if I was still fiddling with certain aspects of our original plan, something still wasn’t right. And lacking the knowledge, training & experience to be able to successfully resolve the issue ourselves, we reached out & engaged professional assistance. Trust your gut instincts & stick with it... leave no stone unturned as you strive for the house of our dreams. Best to change the plan a thousand times than try to make changes after the fact... or live with something that irritates you :) love to see the next draft Wendy if you’re happy to allow us to be part of your journey :)

We are empty nesters one year and our son lives with us the following year (he works for Aust Antartic Division on a contract basis) but we want to build a home that suits most demographics. For our family the MPR will most likely be a 2nd TV area :)

Any thoughts anyone on the desirability of removing the whole wall where the desk is shown in MPR?

I do like the floor plan with Bed 1 at the front..it is excellent per se but it doesnt quite work for us because of the side the laundry is positioned, mudroom and study not required (at the expense of an integrated Patio within 245m2).

I am so grateful to everyone for giving of themselves with ideas and time. Your generosity has given me concrete improvements and also inspiration to work out ways to improve this plan.

Hi Wendy, just wondering ... if the mpr room will be more used for tv viewing, perhaps a media/theatre room would serve you better? Versus having an mpr/activity type room that looks to be more used only for the occupants of the bedrooms? An independent media/theatre room will encourage others in the house to use it for its desire purpose?

apart from your adult son how will you use the three small bedrooms and MPR?

The bedrooms are 3m x 3m with WIR and whilst not large, they are reasonable size (considering we dont want to go over 245m2)...building costs are quite expensive in Central Qld relatively speaking.

We have a dedicated media room now which is great but is isolated in relation to family living. We are of the opinion that an (all purpose) separate living which caters for various age groups, for re-sale, is probably more versatile. Also you can't sell 3 bedroom homes here...has to be 4 plus pool and shed.

Hi Wendy, when I saw this I thought of you, it's bigger but thought it has some good ideas cheers

Siriuskey...hello thank you so much for thinking of our floor plan dilemmas...I could certainly adapt some of those ideas. I am doing some more research before heading back to the draftsman. Cheers.

I think what that plan siriuskey's put up demonstrates well is scaling balance - once you get over a certain size/building program the spaces need to be appropriately scaled. It's a so much better zoned set-up/plan. Yes re-sale is always a factor, but you can't let it drive the whole design. Prioritise your needs first and foremost and then see what opportunity is to maximise the outcome as cost effectively as possible with the peripheral "resale" aspects integrated cleverly. Perhaps you consider a study/4th Bedroom if the kids are grown up..........

Siriuskey is there some way I could see the facade and overall meterage size?

Don't have that info but could draw it up tomorrow, just checking with a friend.

I’d replace wir to bed3&4 with std bir as second living or media or rumpus room worth more on resale

Wendy the floorplan I posted comes in at around 318 sq m including the garage, I knew it was bigger than your 245 sq m, so now I'am looking at re jigging a few things, to reduce the overall size, cheers

Hi, Siriusky, noticed that the plan your rejigging has the laundry on left hand side. I noticed that comment from Wendy said,
"We had our minds set on the outdoor area being lined up with the back of the house so will have to think on that arrangement :) and also the drying area can only be alongside the garage so the Laundry needs to be on that side. " thanks.

Back to the butlers pantry. This photo was put on houzz a few days ago. This would be my ideal BP. A place to stash the mess, but not separate from the kitchen. Just close the doors and no one will know.

Hi Dreamer, yes she did want the laundry on the other side, this floor plan was just to show other possibilities for her over all floor plan, ie: master bed etc. Personally I don't see a problem with the laundry being opposite to what Wendy was thinking as you only have to walk across the family room, but it's Wendys house so it must be what she wants. Thanks for the photos of the pantry it's the design that I have been pushing lately as against a separate room, cheers

Thanks to everyone especially Siriuskey. Iam blown away that you woukd go to thus much effort for me and my family. I feel bad for asking questions re the facade as I assumed you had it easily on hand to guve me an idea. Please do not go out of your way in providing this as I would not want to impose, however, grateful and thankful I am that you would do this for us :)

Hi Wendy here is a front elevation, the black is the double door entrance, the garage is on the right with the door open and one car. I have also stepped the double doors entrance back to the start of the narrow passage way so you get an entrance courtyard.

I really like that facade. Thank you so much. It is brilliant of you to take the time Siriuskey.

I had reservations about our plan but through the knowledge and inspiration I have received from you Houzzers, I got some wonderfull ideas to enhance it that I can take to the draftsman and the ideas will improve it greatly.

I have taken in the thoughts and ideas of posters. Some I've agreed with and others that I didn't agree with were still of great benefit because then I was able to fully assess what suited me and our family and tweek the suggestions. I am researching further and asap I have something to share, I will. Warm regards Wendy.

Hi Wendy, I have played with the plan I posted to reduce and change things for you to add to your considerations. The following floor plan came in at just over 219 sq m, but for some reason it disappeared and I haven't been able to get it back at this time, frustrating. cheers.

That looks a very good plan. I will digest the new layout and our thoughts. I am hesitant to add anything observations Siriuskey cos you have already gone far above and beyond our expectations and I don't want to overburden you. It's wonderful input from you. Cheers.