If hinge on fridge door is on left side leave as is. Otherwise whichever you use more should be in fridge location. But really doesn’t matter if the pantry is set to depth required for fridge

It would help to see more dimensions, ie width of the kitchen and island distance from sink to Island. I would also consider moving the Wall oven to the other end, to make access between the cook top and sink clearer

what is the purpose of the pantry when you have so much scullery and underbench storage space?? i would rather have more bench and display shelves in the pantry location

If the pantry is to be used for food stuffs I would swap the fridge with the pantry, this will also allow for a buffer between family fridge use and kitchen

dimensions. thank you all! Yes perhaps move wall oven to.other side. May be better access from stove top to sink. Thought I'd need an actual pantry cupboard as I don't have one in the scullery.

Are you preparing food in the scullery or just hiding the dirty dishes? If you are preparing food and cooking in the kitchen, then I would keep the pantry where it is. Just swap with the fridge.

I would swap the fridge and pantry. I use the fridge much more than the pantry when preparing food. It is so easy to transfer food from fridge to bench when they are close. I just reach into fridge and place on bench without moving.

awesome will swap position of fridge with pantry. thank you. Do you think how I have positioned the bin, sinks and DW in the scullery is ok? A few people have said move DW to left side as you walk into scullery but I thought placing it in a walkway was not the best position. What do you think?

DW

Difficult question for me. It wouldn't be my choice to have the dishwasher in the walkway. However it is much further to carry dirty dishes in the present position. The less walking involved carrying food and dishes the better.

Would you consider something like this, bin in the Island plus a small sink at the fridge end for cooking water and emptying same

I have a dishwasher in the pantry and one in the main kitchen, i think if possible put a dishwasher near the sink in the main kitchen. I’d be dropping knives and forks etc to get everything into the pantry.

We have a quick access pantry (the kitchen designer called it that) in the main kitchen similar to you and then a large scullery. The idea is to put your every day things in there, spreads, cereals, spices, salt and pepper, we‘ve only got 1.5 shelves currently being used (ok I’m not a great cook!), with everything else stored in the scullery, so i would consider maybe combining your wall oven and pantry space into one near the fridge, and then you can centre the cooktop on the back run.

My rough sketch didn't explain how moving the doors back into the scullary and laundry should look, They would slide back into the cavity behind the cooktop, allowing for a better opening into both spaces. This then allows for a Fridge, Wall oven and a good sized Food pantry within the kitchen, Then centre the cooktop and possibly even remove the return walls to open up that benchtop which gives more access to put down space for things from the pantry including the island and pots to sink. Removing the sliding doors back will open up a great spot for a DW and or a MW, Hope this makes more sense

Just ignore if this is not what you are looking for as it depends on how you use your space. Maybe this could be a solution if a bit clunky to solve the walking and carrying which bothers me. If you shift your wall oven as others have suggested leaving a decent length of bench top to the left of the cook top, could a lift up hatch be installed opening into the scullery. Dirty dishes etc could be placed on the bench here and then loaded straight into the dishwasher in the scullery. This would suit me as being more efficient. This could be a hidden opening if it was incorporated into the splash back material. I am tentative about it but kitchen designers can make anything work.

we have sliding glass splashback doors that conceals shallow shelves that could work to also conceal an opening into an adjoining pantry

I wouldn't have dishwasher in scullery unless also having one in main kitchen. Are you really planning on storing all you plates etc back there?

The following to backup my earlier sketch, Fridge, Wall Oven, Pantry together.

Extra small drinks sink in the Island, this will also be useful when cooking

Sink DW coffee station followed by trash on other side of the wall in the WIP, I have two, one for recycling and one for kitchen scraps

A single large sink in the WIP for large pots, BBQ, additional DW if you want

Sliding doors into the WIP and laundry are full height square set and 1100 wide, the wall needs to be able to accommodate these doors along with elec, and any gas connections

Recently did a kitchen Reno and put in a scullery, best thing we did. Dishwasher is in scullery, similar to your plan and crockery stored under island for easy serving, works great. Hides mess but also able to close off when dishwasher running, none are silent. We also put main sink here and just a small sink in main kitchen. I suggest moving dishwasher to bin location ( just switch them). Having it in scullery is really only about 3 extra steps.

Our scullery doubles as a pantry and have found a lot of food/ snacks get prepped in here further cutting mess.

Door to scullery and laundry same size and I suggest 820. Leave doors as per your plan, maximizing space in scullery and laundry ( they are the areas that do the heavy work after all) But allows the separation from scullery/ laundry areas I feel your after.

Make sure depth of pantry/ fridge wall is depth of fridge, amazed how many stick out proud of cabinetry.

Best Of luck.

Pantry could fit easily into scullery backing onto laundry (just needs greater depth) if dishwasher moved to other side of sink where bin currently is.

The width of the Scullery and Laundry doors won't reduce any storage space it just gives better access and avoids that annoying wasted extra wall jutting out which is not your usual door trim size, but even a 900 door would be better than an 820, 900 is only the width of normal external doors. The sink, dishwasher and waste bin should be positioned to suit how you work, Combing the Wall oven with the fridge and pantry makes better sense than having the wall oven next to the cooktop,

As per the dimensions you supplied that wall is 700 deep so I'am guessing that's what fits your fridge? Most of the other bench's are 650 as per your plan and not your usual 600

The Pantry space shown is approx 1400 wide, this will depend on the size of your fridge, I would look at using retractable double doors for this pantry.

I should have been more specific; The width of the doors won’t reduce storage space in scullery or laundry but placement would. Alternate placement (behind cooktop wall) would mean loosing approx 700 of bench space in each. Just something worth considering. 900 door wasn’t given as option by home owner.

Wall oven with pantry and fridge; just worth considering where you would place hot trays when removing them. Are you likely to want space next to oven for this?

The Island would be used put down for anything from the fridge , Oven and pantry, the small sink would need to be moved across to allow for this, what is taken from the Scullery is gained in the kitchen, The space taken from the Laundry, could be combined with the pantry to include a broom cupboard or what ever you would like it to be,, so small changes but all space is still kept. There are many ways to lay things out it just depends on individual choice.

Personally, I would never want a window behind a sink. The splashes make for a constant cleaning nightmare - but I admit to being a lazy cleaner! Also, I would always prefer a bench beside a fridge or freezer to put things down on when loading and when taking things out. It seems like there's quite a distance to carry things from the fridge to a bench in your design. I also agree that there's too much walking to take dirty dishes to the scullery to wash and then back to the kitchen.

I couldn't put a large sink or dishwasher in our scullery because of plumbing issues, so the scullery has a small sink for preparation (washing and peeling veg, etc and washing the utensils I use when baking, and the dishwasher lives in the kitchen. Yes, it means a little more mess in the kitchen at times, but I find it far more convenient overall.

Actually, if this were my house, I'd put the dishwasher right behind the wall dividing kitchen and scullery, and the larger sink next to it, so that it's all very close to the kitchen but still out of sight. Then keep the long bench clear for appliances and preparation, thus keeping all the mess up one end of both kitchen and scullery, close to the cooking area. I would probably swap the hotplate and oven, so the hotplate is closer to the sink. Change the pantry to a bench for convenience when loading and unloading the fridge.

I'm always amazed at why people want to do kitchen things in what is basically a walk in cupboard.

Does anyone remember the old style kitchens that became open plan because people didn't like being shut off from everything, this is reverting back to those days and they didn't even have dishwashers! to help with cleaning up

i have to agree with siruskey...i would rather have a bigger dining area and more counter instead of the pantry next to the fridge and use scullery just for storage

I agree also, however the owner has said she would like to hide the dirty dishes in this scullery area. The prep and cooking was being done in the kitchen. That is why there are no cooking appliances in the scullery.

I to, think that the kitchen is for all the kitchen work. A pantry for storage is all that is required.

I'll half agree, siriuskey. I like my kitchen open enough that I can be part of the action, but I hate this modern idea of the sink in the middle of the island, as the focal point of the entire living area. (I had no choice in the house we are renovating, but I would have far preferred it over to the side out of the way). I do love having a large scullery where all my appliances can sit out on the bench ready for use, and I don't have to lift them out of cabinets. Happily, the way my scullery opens from the kitchen (it used to be a hallway from kitchen to laundry) I can still see into the living area and be seen when in there doing messy food preparation, but it keeps the worst of the mess out of the kitchen and lets me keep utensils and appliances right at hand without cluttering the kitchen.

I guess I didn't have to compromise dining space to have a nice big scullery, as my living area is huge. And changing the kitchen design to eliminate a hallway and useless store room meant I could enlarge the kitchen substantially and have loads of counter space.

Looking at your sketch and the plan again, I agree the wall oven should be over where the fridge is, making for more space around the hotplate. I would then put the fridge over on the opposite wall so it's closer to the sink. I think fridges should always be reasonably close to the sink for convenience wiping out and in case you have to lift anything out that might drip a little. (Condensation often results in drips, and I wrap my fresh greens in wet towels, so I like to be close to the sink when putting them in and taking them out.)

I think I'd go for something like this (sorry, I'm not as neat as siriuskey!). Remove the nib walls on either side of the cooking wall so the hotplate is more accessible. Move the fridge over near the sink. Put the sink and DW near the door between kitchen and scullery so it's not too far away from where dishes and pots and pans are stored and used. Move the wall oven over as siriuskey suggested so there is lots of space around the hotplate.

I agree that the fridge could and would be better to be moved next to the sink, this would help cover any sideways view of any sink area mess, From memory that could make access to the fridge from the Alfresco easier

Wow! Thank you so much everyone. I have just logged back into Houzz and discovered all this discussion on our kitchen. 😊😊 I have never built before and this forum has really made it clear to me that I actually am clueless when it comes to design. I actually don't even know how I use a space. I've never had to consciously consider what routines I perform in a kitchen. I still am struggling! All I know is that I am a person who struggles immensely with organisation and keeping things clutter free. My husband is completely opposite and I drive him insane at time. He refers to me as a Hurricane and constantly points out the "spot fires" I have going in our house (piles of mess). I do have a disorder and so find organisation and linear thought a challenge. All I do really know, without doubt...is the following:

1. I have spent the last 6 months doing washing at the local laundromat. I actually enjoy it. It first started simply from our WM breaking down. 6 months on I enjoy going to a space where I have plenty of bench space to fold, a place/rail to hang delicates and enough room to also have a washer and dryer. I have never owned a dryer in my life as we live in hot sunny Perth but going to the laundromat has actually saved me so much time by washing and drying in one hit. In our new renovated home, I realise having a good sized laundry with WM, dryer, hanging rail and linen cupboard is a must. We have eliminated our large linen cupboard from our current hallway to increase size of family bathroom.

2. My kitchen is always in a mess. For past two years I have had no DW and I blame it on that. However my sister pointed out at my old house I had a DW and it still was a mess. 🙃 I would like to keep the scullery closed off from my mess so as I can deal with it without seeing it on display. I can see my scullery being a place to store large appliances and food items. I can't see myself prepping food in there. Perhaps a place to make tea and coffee and make toasties/sandwiches? I like to be out in the open preparing food, not in a scullery. I don't want the scullery to feel like a den so I thought by adding windows as splashbacks might add some natural light.

3. Location of pantry I have in main kitchen as the current scullery just has bench and overheads with no actual tall pantry. I am unsure where to place pantry. To be honest I have looked at pinterest and just copied where people tend to place their appliances. I lack understanding of how these items function when carrying out daily routines eg hotplate to sink etc...

Given this info, how would you design my kitchen? I love and appreciate all the time and effort invested into my design. I love how clear the openings would be if we eradicate the nib walls, however losing 700mm of room in each scullery and laundry is too much I think. Especially with my desire for a bigger working space (laundry)

I really just want a space that is easy for me. Functional and a happy and orderly place. Thank you Houzzers 💛

My current kitchen 🙃🙃🙃

You don't lose any space from laundry or scullery by removing the nib walls around the cooking area. You just make the hotplate much more accessible. And moving the oven means the hotplate is more reachable from the sink, which is important. Blocking the HP off from the sink is not a good idea. When cooking, you often need to add water to a pot or drain a pot into the sink.

I believe a fridge should always be reasonably handy to the sink because you do occasionally pull drippy things out or put drippy things in, and you want to wipe it out regularly.

Keeping the sink mess out of the kitchen is a great idea in my view, but you need it close, because you will be constantly carrying dishes and cutlery back and forth and carrying washing up mess to the dishwasher and clean dishes back to cabinets is not the best way to keep fit!

The house we bought had a very small kitchen with a cramped area for the hotplate, leaving hardly any space beside it. That drove me crazy, even though it only took days to pull it out and enlarge the space. I now have a nice big counter area either side of the hotplate and I think that's essential. Mine is enclosed between nib walls, but it's a very different kitchen design. In your kitchen, I think the nib walls close off the cooking area too much and would be an obstruction when moving around.

You definitely need to ensure there is counter space handy to both fridge and oven, because you need to put things down quickly when removing things from either. When you return from a shopping trip, you have quite a few items to put in the fridge and you will find it very annoying to not be able to put your shopping bags or boxes close to the fridge for unloading.

I have never had the luxury before, but in my newly renovated kitchen I have a drawer for coffee, tea, sugar, mugs, teaspoons etc. right under where my kettle lives so making tea or coffee for everyone requires no moving about. It's handy to the seating area so guests can sit and chat while I make their tea or coffee for them.

If the sliding door opens to an outdoor eating/BBQ area, consider a servery window somewhere along the side of the kitchen or pantry for passing out food to be cooked on the BBQ and passing dirty dishes back in for washing.

Tall pantry is fine next to the oven as long as the insulation around the oven is adequate to not heat stored foods, but there's enough room for a bench in between oven and pantry which would work better.

I agree with your comments about the laundry. Lots of storage and plenty of bench space for folding is essential. I love the rail over my tub for hanging dripping delicate items. It extends over the washing machine and I hang shirts etc. on hangers there to air or when ironing. I love my dedicated ironing station in the corner. I moved the clothes line to just outside the laundry door though, as I couldn't see the logic in having to walk the full length of the house and then some to get from laundry to line. I would also strongly recommend a small line under cover somewhere if it's achievable, for wet weather drying - regardless of having a dryer. In our previous home, which I designed from scratch, I had a covered fly-screened utility porch with clothes line, dryer (so there's no condensation in the laundry), bins, and space for outdoor cleaning and gardening utensils. If you have a roofed area, or even wide eaves, putting the dryer outside works well, or otherwise you need very good ventilation in the laundry.

Good luck with it. I had a lot of help here to design my kitchen and scullery and it turned out just great, thanks for a few Houzz members making some brilliant suggestions.

I think you could be at the stage where you could be overloaded with good advice. Too many opinions make it even more confusing. I think you need to think hard, list what you want, select the ideas that resonate and see if you can bounce ideas with someone. Then maybe post again after you come up with a refined plan. See what the houzzers think again. I dont know about you but I've always been able to visualize what I want and then go for it.

You can't blame yourself for your current untidy kitchen that's due to lack of storage to put things away into. I sometimes think that you would be better off with a well planned separate kitchen with windows to the outdoor areas. as I don't think having a Scullery will solve the way you like to live,that's part of you.

I would alway prefer to have a Pantry with bifold or retractable doors with all the appliances etc tucked away behind the doors so that gives you an instant cleanup of the kitchen. I don't understand the new trend to have dying rooms cabinets etc. I have a pullout clothes across the top of my bench that takes care of that,

Keep on using the laundromat if that's what you find works for you, makes life easy

Just another quick suggestion. I saw a TV show recently offering advice on kitchen design. They cut out large cardboard squares the size of each appliance, fitting, etc. and placed everything on the floor or counter where they might go, labeling each and writing the names of items that would be stored in each location. Then they walked around pretending to cook a meal, make tea, clear away and wash dishes, etc., I thought it was a great way to get a feel for how functional your proposed design is.

@Lyn Wood. This is not the first time that the poster, beaumitchell has posted about the kitchen, asking for advice.
The design now posted, is the accumulation of or the comments from the previous posts.
So I do agree, Beaumitchell, you need to renovate this kitchen in the way that is the best for you. This week, every time you do a activity in the kitchen, take note and write down, how you are doing it, is there improvement that can be made and transfer these notes into your kitchen concept. All the best.

Although this has been a long dilemma , thinking about what you just said about being unable to be a tidy lady, I would like to add the following as a possibility, a bit reminiscent of kitchens gone by. Make the Scullery the kitchen with a token kitchen in front of that.

The spaces would separated with either Bifold or a large pocket door that slides back into the dividing wall of the kitchen..

You would still have the large island for family and friends to enjoy with lots of storage, narrow shelving behind it with a bank of extra pantry/ storage on the other wall.

The messy part of the kitchen where the majority of the cooking will be done can be quickly closed off or just partially. A MW can be added near the sink or in the Island.

Anyway just another idea.

This last one is to show what the kitchen could look like when the doors are open

Sorry this should have posted above

Our scullery has certainly helped our “clean freaks” and “hurricanes” live in harmony (I like the way your husband put that). Trust in yourself, your plan seems to suit what you have described of your life and wishes. A few minor tweaks given the feedback that speaks to you.

I have just moved into a new house where we designed a kitchen/scullery very similar to yours - kitchen for preparation and cooking while being part of the household and the scullery for dirty dishes and storage of crockery and food items that are used occasionally or for sandwiches and snacks (little preparation). There is also a drinks area just outside the scullery (with a very small sink and a tap that has a choice of ready hot or chilled water - it is used constantly). The fridge is placed in the middle between the main preparation kitchen and the scullery where the toaster is also kept. People wanting coffee, toast, snacks can access everything without bothering the person/ people cooking. Our hot plates and wall oven are separated by an L-shaped bench with a single sink, which works very well. However, the sink is much closer to the oven than the hot plates which was bad planning. I underestimated the number of times I move between the sink and the stove top (including rinsing my hands between tasks). The sink needs to be close to the cooktop - and, because you are not stacking dirty or drying dishes there, the amount of bench space between the cooktop and sink does not need to be all that large.

One other thing that I am really glad we upgraded to is a synthetic stone bench that is allows you to put pans on directly from the oven (most do not) - brilliant. It also allows you to cut directly in in. I usually don't do this, not because I ma concerned about the bench top but because I dont want to blunt my good knives :)

siriuskey, that is absolutely brilliant! I love it. Wish there was a way to do that in my house. I really hate the fact that the sink is the focal point of the whole living area. Can't understand why people think that's a good idea!

Margot, what - specifically - is your bench made of? You have peaked my curiosity. Synthetic stone benches generally don't tolerate heat well at all. They are usually made with a resin and stone mix and both heat and knives damage them, though most will tolerate a higher heat than laminate can withstand. There are lots of brands of synthetic stone (also known as 'engineeered stone' or quartz), with Caesarstone being possibly the best known. I believe there are variations in heat tolerance depending on the ratio of stone to resin. Interestingly, one of the most heat tolerant is made in Australia and is by far the cheapest option - though their colours and designs are limited and I found them rather unappealing. Corian is also an option and I am not sure how it withstands heat. I wouldn't think it would be referred to as 'synthetic stone' though. And being acrylic based, I would be surprised if it was very heat tolerant.

We installed a porcelain bench. Expensive, but totally stain and fade-proof and almost impossible to damage. Withstands heat and knives (but yes, blunts the knives). Maybe that's what yours is? I'd hate for anyone to read your post and think they could choose one of the popular synthetic stone bench materials and put a hot pan on it. It would ruin most surfaces.

thank you @Lorraine Cobcroft, the island can even hold appliances in drawers that can be lifted up onto the Island benchtop, as I do, little and big kids can join in with the baking experience, the wall Side board could be setup with baking goods, flour etc in attractive containers. I like to use the glass ones you can get from Kmart, a bit like Martha Stewart ware. in the cabinet, I also have some old cooking things like scales,chopping boards, rollong pins etc that are great to display. The cooking is done in the tucked away kitchen, and baking utensils popped into the DW or sink for cleanup

beaumitchell, after analysing your difficulties and what you're asking for, Siriusky's plan with the central bifold or sliding doors could work perfectly for you. Turning the scullery into the working kitchen means you can make as much mess as you like, use the trolley to transport food, dishes etc and then close off your domain and forget it. It's out of sight and you can deal with it or not. Other family members can get a drink or a biscuit without even entering your area if you choose and everyone can socialise at the island bench without you stressing. Having such a large central opening means you are not cut off from everyone else when you are using the scullery.

The Trolley is like an Old fashioned "Dumb Waiter" which was used exactly like that, the Butler, would place everything on it in the "Butlers Pantry" and wheel it out into the dining room. or in this case to the island if preferred

In answer to Lorraine's question, the material we used is called Dekton. It is pretty bullet-proof; comes in a large range of 'natural' patterns and in large sheets( therefore minimal joins). We used 20 mm Sirocco for the bench tops and 4mm Sirocco for the splashback above the benches.

Ah. It's porcelain, Margot. Not synthetic stone. And yes it IS heat proof and scratch proof - the best kitchen bench top there is, but expensive both to buy and to install. Worth it though, in my opinion.

We used Laminam, which is basically the same material. We were going to use Dekton but the sheet sizes were just a tiny tad smaller and the installer suggested we go to Laminam to get a seamless bench top. Also used 20mm for the benches (with a shadow line under) and 4mm for splashbacks. We chose Calacatta Michelangelo with a pale grey shadow line and Pale Tendril Quarter two-pac cabinet fronts. I did a lot of research before making my choice because I had granite in my last house and it discoloured. Also, I fought with stains as my hubby splashes red wine and turmeric around way too much! Porcelain is stain-proof. No regrets. Apparently porcelain can chip and is difficult or impossible to repair invisibly if it does, but it is very tough. We are very happy with it.

Perhaps sliding doors like these will help minimise the separation instead of a nib wall and cavity slider? They could be wider as suggested by siriuskey?